---
title: WWDC2004 Session 638
framework: wwdc
role: article
path: wwdc/wwdc2004-638
---

# WWDC2004 Session 638

## Transcript

Kind: captions Language: en please welcome our first presenter of the morning director hardware storage Alex Grossman good morning everyone thank you very much for getting up early on a Friday morning after a really great night last night I appreciate everybody being able to do that we're going to start this morning we've got a lot to cover and hopefully it's going to be a very useful everyone I've got a pretty full agenda and I've got some great guest speakers to talk to us about some real-world stuff that we're going to talk about but before we do that I want to go through some calisthenics in the morning so we're going to use where users are right hand or left hand a little bit so to get an idea just just to help us give me an idea of how many people are familiar with the terms that i'm just going to relay here first one is dad's direct attached storage ok how many people are deploying direct attached storage today ok not that many how many people are familiar with the term navs or a network attached storage and how many people are deploying network attached storage a lot of people and how about the last one is san storage area network and how many people are deploying those ok that's great so for the other hand the other the other and we got to use the other hand for this one how many people are familiar with fibre channel networking ok great and how about I scuzzy not too many ok great fantastic so let's get started let's talk a little bit about the agenda what we're going to cover first thing I want to do is uh oh last question is how many people today have X Server AIDS cool ok so the first thing imma do is give you a little quick refresher on the xserve raid talk about what's unique about it and you know we're seeing a year or so ago you know Apple is probably the only one out there in a tier 1 storage vendor with an 80 a base trade system we're seeing a lot more ACA out there but not all of them are created equal and we think we have something unique in the xserve raid then we're going to talk just a little bit about raid basics and where we see that whole market going on what's going on there and then a lot about storage planning and what it's really like to plan a deployment in storage and then we have we have one of the biggest areas that we get questions in and this is constant from people is they really understand what do I do in fibre channel infrastructure what it really look like what should it look like what's the future look like you know the costs have been really high and we want to take a stab at what what it's really going to look like so we're really happy to have qlogic San architect with us Ryan clients we're going to we're going to have him come up and talk about that and then we have a customer deployment a real life example of where we actually had we had apple and some partners get together and do a great deployment for one of our customers then we're going to wrap it up a little bit and talk a little bit about best practices and some q and eggs sound like fun good so let's get started first thing is let's talk about extra of raid and and what it really is so extra of raid is really a storage building block so it's a high availability design system it's a 3u enclosure basically it can scale up to three and a half terabytes and it can scale up to nearly 400 megabytes per second sustain throughput so that is really and read and write performance very high and very very competitive with systems that cost a lot more the other thing about xserve raise is that it's extremely versatile so it can be used in a dad's deployment and we'll call that our sched we replace minh strategy it can be used with combining it with an xserve g5 or an xserve or even even a powermac and use it in as type of configuration and it has capabilities in it that allow it to be used as stand alone or combined with other systems to build great span infrastructure probably the most important thing about xserve raise is the high availability design and what I mean by that is that everything in the box is swappable so the design really lends itself from systems that have cost a lot more money traditionally where the components are either completely redundant or they're swappable easily and so the downtime usually there's none but if there's ever downtime it's usually extremely minimal and that comes from just looking at the front of the system where you see 14 hard drives that can easily be unplugged from the system in the back of the system what you see is you see a clean design and apple design from the ground up we didn't start with existing designs or use pieces or parts that we're out there we actually start a clean to design a system that had high availability built in and we have redundant power redundant cooling we had a hot or hot swappable components throughout warm swappable raid controllers we have a passive mid plane for the data and so what you end up with if you pull all the components out is you end up with a metal box with a with a mid plane or a board in the middle that that does passive signaling through it so very easy to change and update the system as you need to so this is this one of the great points of the xserve rape now beyond the high availability design one of the things that really sets x server eight apart from a lot of the other systems out there is the management we chose to go with a java-based management tool for extra of raid and it's something that we've updated constantly since we introduced the extra raid in fact what you're what you're going to see and one of the things I can tell you about now is you're going to see an update to the raid admin utility that's actually happening next week and I was very fortunate last year to be able to show you a significant update this one's a little smaller but it's a performance update so we're constantly updating the performance and scalability of the xserve raid the beauty of the rated main utility is it allows you to do monitoring of one or even hundreds of systems from a single screen and it also allows you to manage these systems very easily and do all the management tasks remotely and that was mainly driven by people like me who just are lazy and you know don't want to get up early in the morning to find out what's going on your system they just want to do it from home and the other thing is we've added more and more sand capabilities and high-availability features like lund masking and mapping to the system and things like being able to rebuild parody on the fly and we're doing a lot more of that when the new release comes out you're going to see a lot more of those capabilities just built in so this is really a tool that is built for every platform yet it looks stunning on the mac platform it's really a phenomenal tool the other thing about xserve raid and this this was a request that we had here last year from just about everybody who attended was that we we had people deploying xserve raid on a number of platforms beyond the mac but we hadn't gone through the actual certification and compatibility yet it was it was kind of funny that our customers really drove us there in fact there was a website that went up last year and it's still really active is called alien raid org and it's really exciting an alien raids org or that they were really the first people it was a group of people who actually said did you know that the xserver aid works on Windows and that it works on solaris and it works on AIX and they really one for the step by step step by step features of actually showing you how you would install it most of those were plug the cables in turn it on so it was really really pretty simple overall but what we did over the last year is we asked our customers who were the infrastructure partners that they really wanted on X or raid and we're open if you if you have suggestions as to who else you'd like to see that we're very open to do that and we chose what we felt were the best of the best and those are people like qlogic and veritas and emulex and brocade and candara and people that you really really care about and then also the traditional Apple Apple vendors like like a doe technology where we really felt they would add a lot to the platform but of course we had a look at popular operating systems as well now I think everybody in here realizes that we work very well on Mac OS 10 but we're also certified on redhat and that's their advanced advanced 2.1 and three also on yellow dog linux which actually runs on our platform and novell in novell five novell six novell 65 windows 2000 surprisingly windows 2003 and windows XP professional so all those certifications have been done and we're continuing to to certify xserve radon more so this way you have guaranteed compatibility for the system and not only in mac and all mac installations but also in heterogeneous installations where it's simple i just like to get a show how many people have a heterogeneous installation the xserve rate wow that's that's a lot more than I've seen in a long time so that's great so let's just go over a quick a quick raid basic so everybody in here should be familiar with multiple levels of rain out I'll tell you these were the these were the levels that were initially defined by by Randy cats at Berkeley in 1987 and these are still what I call the pure raid levels and these these can be combined with other raid levels in here and there are some fancy raid levels that people are looking at today but for the most part these are the raid everybody does and what is a raid level well obviously when you start lowest to highest and number you actually increase in in redundancy or availability and performance if you start with raid 0 it's striping not really a true raid level but a lot of people have or still are deploying striping today for speed because it's one of the easiest ways to take a number of discs combine them together and get performance out of them and then probably the most popular raid level that's used out there is mirroring this is basically just taking either one hard drive or a group a group of hard drives and mirroring them keeping the same data set between them so if one were to fail you have another copy of the data this is the photocopy way of doing things it's not very it's not very efficient it's kind of a wasteful right if I have a copy of something I make a photocopy I waste the two pieces of paper it's the same with with mirroring if i have if i have one hard drive I mirror it I used a hundred percent of the of the second hard drive space for mirroring and as you move up really you get to what i would consider more efficient raid levels and the one that we focus on a lot and the one we've optimized for is raid level 5 and the beauty of raid level five is that it's a distributed parity scheme and what we mean by that is we actually create an algorithm or a piece of data on every one of the hard drive that is a part of the data that's on the rest of the hard drives and essentially what that means is that if you have a hard drive fail we can instantly virtually on-the-fly recreate that data from the remaining hard drive so you have to lose a large number of hard drives before you'd actually have a failure or or lose data and the problem with raid 5 in the past has been that the performance has not been consistent so the read performance is very similar to that of raid 0 it's like striping a bunch of drive the performance is better than a single hard drive but the right performance especially in random writes has been has been slower so people who are doing things like database or online transaction processing anybody do that type of work on their systems so if you're doing that you knew that raid 5 was a bad way to go in the past and also if you're doing things like video anybody doing video here streaming video if you were streaming video raid 5 was also terrible people went to things like raid 3 or in most cases they were just doing raid 0 striping and we serveraid we really looked at that and we put we put our team together and build some really sophisticated algorithms and some caching schemes that really make read five faster in most cases than any of the other raid levels including raid 0 so our performance is really quite good in race 5 and the protection is really good so let's talk about storage planning a little bit this is really the most important part of deployment and really talking about a best practices strategy and its really all common sense but it's things that we don't think about on a daily basis when we when we start there we have to talk about the three different approaches to storage and some of you may not realize you're actually deploying a number of these within your organization the first one is direct attach so we talked about direct attached storage what is that and there's a lot of different different ways that we look at this the first way to look at it is a great example is the xserve g5 it's locally attached hard drive it's the hard drives that are in the xserve g5 that become direct attached and for the most part this is the way traditional storage was done you bought a server you put hard drives in the server and it was a it was a done deal and when you need it more you need it more performance the servers didn't have a lot of performance you added servers and therefore you out of storage and that's the way things scale then it kind of looked like this you had a network down the bottom all your clients and obviously I I could draw hundreds of clients but it's I'm not that good with drawing and you have Ethernet switches those are the gray lines and then you have the two xserve g5 and in this case you know you could have a terabyte and a half of storage online assuming you left it all in either j ba just a bunch of disks or a raid 0 stripe so it's quite a bit of storage but the problem is that it's never enough and so you might take one of your servers which is a let's call it a high youth server this could be your email server for instance and this could be this could be a xserve g5 a mac OS 10 based server this could be a windows server or a linux server and you're going to add some external storage well that works and even you might even find that with the xserve raid because it's a dual ported dual controller design that you want to share half of the storage on one of the boxes and half the storage on the other a little more efficient you get the ability to centralize your storage so that you take advantage of the high availability of the xserve raid yet you get to share it over over to servers or you might find that that's not enough and you just want to attach more storage to your individual servers and this is still direct attached and this is the way things have been done it's truly a traditional approach and it works really easily because today most people have land-based backup so you're backing up across across the land now this was a really good idea when the when the data sets were small how many people can remember a couple years ago when your tire organization ran on a couple hundred gigabytes right I am I had an experience and experience a few months ago in GarageBand first came out and I was actually on a plane and I went to install garage ban on my notebook and I put the CD in and I went to install it and actually in the DVD and it said that I didn't have enough room and this is my notebook and I thought don't have an 80 gig hard drive in here well I had a few of keynote presentations so it was a little hard to do but for the most part backing this amount of data in this case we would have almost seven terabytes of data here imagine backing that up across land anybody go to the backup session earlier this week so you get an idea if for those of you didn't go and those of you who backup terabytes it can really take about in an uncompressed environment over 24 hours to back up a terabyte of storage so you know the backup windows are shrinking so this land based backup doesn't seem to work very well in in this occasion where you have a lot of storage so when you start looking at this you go well one of the problems is I need to share the storage but I have something like this where I'm pretty dedicated that one xserve raid let's call it three and a half terabytes is dedicated to that server and the other xserve raid is dedicated to the other server so my resource sharing is limited so I better guess right as to how much storage i really need on each server let's say one of those servers needed 6 terabytes and the other one needed one terabyte in the direct attach world it's really hard to do right you just can't what we're called what we'll call provisioning that storage over between the two systems so when you look at this and you look at that traditional approach is it still viable in today's world and a lot of people look at it and they say sure it's viable because it's a lower initial investment I don't have to do much planning I know that I can just buy one and attach it but there are problems with scalability and there's problems with longevity because a lot of times that storage is internal to your servers and when it's time to replace the server Moore's law kicks in it's time to replace that server you end up not having storage that's compatible and that's the beauty of an xserve rate if you deploy it because its external its fibre channel it's just going to plug in but you also find out that you're pretty limited on that back up in that restoration so it's not really the ideal approach so what else do you do what is what most people do most people have moved to a network attached storage model they start out with some type of direct attached and usually it's many more than 22 servers are out there and they take some type of direct attached nazz right onto the network so it's attaching to that that gray wire that's there indicating our network and in my case I chose to take an xserve g5 and an xserve raid and use that as an as replacement and that works it works and it's it gives you the ability to share that storage across the network to both servers so you get some provisioning because what you can do is you can you can dedicate you don't have to dedicate those resources you can leave them open and it has expandability but the expandability becomes limited because what happens at this point is now the wire that's coming out of the xserve g5 that that single Ethernet becomes the bottleneck and because your backbone unless you're building a 10 gigabit fiber backbone or just 10 gigabit ethernet backbone you're really pretty limited in the overall performance is going to do how many people have a four gigabit ethernet backbone out there how about a ten so I still have one hand so really you're pretty much limited how many people have gigabit backbone that's just about everybody out here so imagine that if each exergy five can saturate that gigabit backbone how is your storage being attached going to do that and this is really what most people do most people have deployed a network-attached specialty appliance and they're just an embedded nass so this is a very lightweight as server and the reason they've done this is there's no client access licenses just like an xserve g5 but they're usually inexpensive and usually what happens is you end up with this and you end up with a lot of different little appliances out there and the problem with that is that while it gives you a heterogeneous approach and while it has a lower investment it is a management nightmare and it's very difficult to manage that and it's very difficult to know what's failed and you find that you start plugging them in all over and when you have an ethernet problem it's really a problem it is a big problem because you lose accessibility to the storage and whether we like it or not anybody here ever crimp in Ethernet cable okay if you've crimped an Ethernet cable you know that you usually one out of three you're going to screw up and usually it fails like six months later when it's hanging there and this is part of the problem with hanging everything on the network that network was made to deliver small packets and it wasn't really made to deliver the performance and the reliability to a lot of different servers it is truly a collision based network but for most people that works and in fact most people who who start their tend to move to this the navs appliances and we know who they are they're they're generally extremely expensive in a per gigabyte cost but they have a lot of features they do things like snapshotting which means that you can replicate the data really quickly and their appliance like though generally easy deployment they have a built-in they have a built-in file system and for the most part these very high-end appliances have an operating system and a file system and they also have the downside of being a single vendor lock-in once you go with them you're for the most part using their management tools and you're having to buy them again and again and again and it gets pretty expensive and you know we all know those people and they're good things or their companies like network appliance and EMC they build really really nice products and they still have the issue of having that single point of connectivity to Ethernet now they may have multiple ethernet ports but generally you're not going to have hundreds of Ethernet switches you're going to have one or two very high-end switches and what if you don't have a high-end infrastructure you're really funneling everything through a gigabit has anybody here ever seen gigabit ethernet perform at gigabit so that's one of the other issues that we run into all time so what is the choice the choice is to build a stand and it sounds like a lot of people out here have already taken that step at least so what does the basics and look like in where they scale well most people who build a fan start out again with that direct attached model they start out there and they add storage and I threw in a fibre channel switch in here because I knew I was building a sand so from a best practices standpoint I want to start out with expandability and scalability already in there and you can take an xserve raid today and you can use a tool called lund masking and you can map each address almost like a mac address but we call it a fibre channel worldwide port name and we would map those worldwide port names very easily in the rated min utility to each server so what I've done is I provision storage speech server so the server's can't see each other storage but they see the stories they have really simple implementation and I can add more and as I add more I don't degrade my performance because my back channel network is specialized network called fibre channel in this case and fibre channel is a non-blocking network infrastructure and my performance scales as my capacity scales and we call that a sand island and then people will scale it out so as you scale it out it becomes more heterogeneous the server's become max pcs linux hopefully they're all max but as you scale it out now you can start to deploy more storage on more servers and you're not limited and you can reprovision that storage as you need to and in some cases the manual process in other cases there are partners that can help us provision that storage instantaneously and without any interruption of service now this is really more of what a typical enterprise San island looks like how many people deploy something that looks like this probably knows pretty is a slide so in this case you have a fair amount of you have a fair amount of storage you have a redundant switch architecture and you have backup that's on you're still on your land and you're doing incremental backups and you're really looking at that this is typically a San Island what do I mean by an island well a lot of people say I have deployed a fan completely in my infrastructure so I have a complete fan and for the most part people haven't what they've done is they've dedicated islands of sand out there and they've connected them together which is usually been very expensive to do and hopefully we're going to we're going to learn that that's getting less expensive now that the next thing that you really look at is what's called a three tier implementation and three tier is something that we're going to talk about in a minute cold storage tiering which really gives you the most viability of the storage you own today in the storage you're going to buy tomorrow because hopefully the total overall cost of your infrastructure is going to be lowered and actually even though it looks more complex that's going to take the complexity out and this is an example that we see over and over again where someone has primary storage serving a number of servers let's face it even in a single xserve raid you're getting you know almost three-and-a-half terabytes of storage it's a lot and you can serve a lot of servers with that but the problem is if you're in an environment where you're turning over a terabyte of storage a day you're not going to be able to do delta backups every day so what do you do you put in a second tier of storage here now I'm going to talk a lot about tears but in this in this case this extra tier is storage uses a dedicated backup server and a lot of software and if you tended to backup session you'll know there's a number of a number of companies and on the mac OS 10 platform that do this both from a client and server basis companies like backbone a tempo and dance and they're able to actually staged this from disk to disk and that happens a lot faster using a dedicated backup server and then they take that secondary dis to disk backup schedule it so it happens often and then they'll actually move it to tape and so when they move it to tape the archive they free up their secondary backup and they're able to actually do this so this architecture is something we're seeing more and more and as storage costs come down this becomes a really viable alternative and so why would we want to go to storage area networking and what are the upsides and the downsides well the first thing to know it's a complete storage communication infrastructure it was designed for storage it has it has the performance to handle storage and it has a scalability so it's highly scalable it's high performance and it's also a mission-critical environment so you can build it as mission-critical as you want so that there are no single points of failure in there or at a low cost you have a fairly good guarantee that you're not going to have the problems that you see in other infrastructures now the other thing that's nice about it is because of the speed of the interface it allows you to do that tiering I just showed you because you can do sophisticated disk to disk copies essentially and the other thing is that today the cost can vary greatly in stance we're just a couple years ago fans were dedicated really to the high end of the enterprise today we see stands in areas especially in the video environment where people have four workers and they're building a storage area network so it scales from modest to extremely outrageous and there's one thing to always be aware of and that is that interoperability is not guaranteed so when you're planning the sand you should plan ahead for for getting certified vendors and really thinking about interoperability the other thing that we hear a lot about is remote replication remote replication is something everybody wants to do and today it's it's usually only used in large enterprises and there are ways though that you can do remote replication in a very easy manner but it really is highly dependent on applications now there are a number of in the extra rate i should say works with nearly every remote replication scheme it looks like a scuzzy target out there but on Mac os10 server there are a number of different remote replication schemes databases can can easily be replicated over IP directory information can easily be replicated and hopefully you visited some of those sessions to learn that and there are appliances out there that can do remote replication for you and they're heterogeneous so it's regardless of the of the type of infrastructure you have you can actually see replication done with companies like falconstor and others where they'll actually do replication and do it over long distance or short distance using fibre channel and IP together and so we're we're really looking at that in the future how many people have deployed remote replication how many people are thinking about it over the next year so there's a lot more people looking at it so we should watch this very carefully as well I got the count of the audience of how many people have direct attached storage san and nads this is what IDC has told us across the enterprise and this includes large enterprises what they call small/medium business this is the way it looks and a lot of the dads that's on here the direct attached is driven by people in small business who just have servers with a direct attached either scuzzy or fibre channel device but the question is what's that going to look like over the next couple years and so they've looked at at it and they've spent in 2007 there's going to be a dramatic switch to San architecture and it's also you're going to see it's going to pull away from that so it'll be this integration of nas and san the convergence word that people are using all time and you're going to see dads drop off because it's much more reliable and much easier to scale and change servers out when your storage is in the background and your servers just need to drive to boot and sometimes I'll even boot off the sand so there's a lot of different ways to do this so if you're going to deploy this what challenges do you face well we all face those same challenges you got to provide cost-effective storage and anybody hear of an IT budget that's growing this year okay that's the problem so there's these other things like compliance that you have to worry about now so we say you need to build a smart storage strategy and that is really way data protection against cost and really build what's considered a tiered environment and what I mean by a tiered environment is that storage can be deployed in a number of different ways the first way is mission critical this is the 24-7 you can never be down and you have to just deliver deliver storage this is expensive this this can really be expensive in these these systems especially fans that our mission critical generally cost hundreds of thousands of dollars and there are ways to do in a more modest manner is anybody visit the X fan deployment this week great so you get an idea that we're trying to low we're trying to lower the cost of that and then there's this business critical environment where most of the data is actually taking place today and that our thats things like email and web where it's more modest but you can actually do it in the cost of storage there most people are still deploying this mission critical costed storage that can cost upwards of forty to a hundred dollars a gigabyte and we we just understand why they're doing that today and then there's the mirror line that that second tier stores that I talked about where you actually do a dis to dis backup and I won't call it a tape elimination strategy but it's it's a way to put off going to tape or not going the tape is often and it's getting very inexpensive I me next overrated three dollars a gigabyte by the time you look at the maintenance of tape drives the initial cost you find that you want to spend more of your time and are in the in the backup strategy with dis to dis than you do in the archive and then of course there's rich media which is a whole nother world that's that's our video clientele where they deliver absolute absolute performance and very minimal downtime or as I like to say you know that the show must go on they can't they can't have downtime and that's that's something really hard to architect for so when we look at those different tiers you see that as they move up and through foot it throughput and availability they also generally move up and cost and there have been some disruptive technologies and the first one is X sort of raid because for the most part with apple and with apples partners both in hardware and software today and we're always looking for more developers to come on and help us with this you can deploy xserve raid in a large variety of these of these areas without really spending the cost and this is really a smart storage strategy if we look at that mission-critical storage environment I picked one an interesting one here because they said I'm not going to pick one on Mac so i'm going to pick one on windows so this is a windows 2003 advanced server with microsoft clustering environment in this case it costs about six dollars a gigabyte to deliver fully redundant mission-critical storage and this is something that today you'd have to spend an incredible amount of money to deliver this with other systems and this is really made possible by extra raid so in this in this case you've got a lot of storage to two servers and it's it's really simple and easy to deploy now here's your typical three-tier storage infrastructure the way it usually really looks it's more than one storage device it's more than one server in its heterogeneous and so you do have a storage pool that's mission-critical a business critical pool and an airline pool that's really the way it looks and today with ex fan you can you can build this or at least 1x manager is released I should say so it all comes down to which storage approach is best and it really depends and what if the tens on is who's managing it so here are some facts and you know you're all going to feel really good or really bad about this because you live in this world so this came from the Yankee Group this was a recent survey forty-eight percent of global 2000 companies have a separate group and IT who manage storage that's huge how many people here are dedicated to just managing storage very few but that's going to change in the future the other thing that's interesting is that fifty percent of the managers consider heterogeneous storage to be a strategic goal for them so we talked about interoperability this is important so if you don't have an all Apple infrastructure you don't have an all windows or in all Linux or an all solaris infrastructure you really need to be heterogeneous and I think the most important thing is that fifty two percent of the people surveyed and I think they surveyed about a thousand IT managers they view the reduced maintenance costs as proof of a return on investment so when you look at deploying tiered storage probably in that high tier of storage that's 42 a hundred dollars a gigabyte you pay that same amount in maintenance every year and that's really where the cost is so when you look at well I can peer this and I can reduce my costs both in the initial cost of the system and in the maintenance costs that's really what it's all about and can I deliver those same services we think so so if you're doing storage planning there's a few things to look at it's really well what do I already have what do I really need how much is it going to cost and so let's take a look at some of those the first one is existing infrastructure there's two things that people don't look at here the first one is how old is the existing infrastructure I hear this term all the time and I guarantee everyone in this audience has used it in storage at least once it's called legacy they all say I have legacy storage that I need to connect to my new storage anybody ever say that yeah we say it a lot right legacy stores well what does that mean does anybody here realized storage where thou I mean that that's another thing that people don't realize in the year 2000 I pay two million dollars for this three letter acronym storage and I have to I have to amortize it over the next 10 years because I paid a lot of money for well storage wears out its rotating media it's not as bad as tires on a car but it does wear out so you have to plan on depreciating that storage over three to five years and getting it out of there and when you do are you going to buy that same monolithic storage you bought before are you going to look differently the other thing to really look at is have you considered a tiered approach lowering the overall cost of storage putting that expensive storage in your mission critical areas and putting lower-cost storage in the business critical and the near line it's something to really consider and then the other one is true capacity requirements and since most of us don't really know what our requirements are going to be we can take a guess but you know who would have thought that from 1998 to 2003 that storage would have been growing from a need standpoint 110 percent per year not a lot of people would have guessed that and they would have guessed low so in deploying something like a storage area network it allows you to actually grow with that storage so you get scalability up down and out every way you can look at so you can redeploy the storage and reprovision it so you need to look at today and look at tomorrow I think the other important thing is throughput so we talked about network-attached versus storage area networks versus direct-attached in the storage area network world in a direct attached world the performance is going to be bottlenecked by the limitation of you to the server or the storage there the limitations in the in the network attached model the throughput or the storage performance is going to be limited by the network so you have to determine what is my application is that megabytes per second is an iOS per second and how many clients do actually have out there so you really have to look at that the other one is really availability requirements do I need it to really be up 24 hours a day 7 days a week with no downtime or can I have a reasonable to 24 hour down time it could be five minutes but let's just assume it's four o'clock in the morning and something happens and it's going to be two hours of downtime is that reasonable I you know is it business critical does it need to be archived how often does it need to be archived can I use in your line these are all questions you have to ask and you have to answer these yourself because there's really no one who can tell you what your business model looks like because they vary so much in fact you'll find that most of the people selling very high-end storage will dictate your business model to you and that's not necessarily the right way to go and the other one is really disaster recovery so there's been a couple things that have really driven that 11 of course was 911 and none of us really wanted that to happen and none of us wanted to have to bear what happened afterward and that was rethink our storage strategy let's get this off site and there's there's really two ways to do it one is to deploy remote replication very expensive generally it doubles your cost because not only do you usually have to replicate the storage you have to replicate servers and infrastructure and everything and the other one is an off-site backup service and you can even carry it off site small companies you know the CFO carries the tapes home and in large companies there there are companies like Iron Mountain that will come pick up your tapes and they'll even load them and unload them if you need to so it's really a cost driven driven thing and when you talk about that you really don't need to talk about compliance because one of the other things anybody here that falls under sarbanes-oxley or know that they do so a lot of larger companies will and the government is taking this very seriously and it's starting to move to Europe and it's starting to move farther throughout the world so these type of compliance that say that you have to find every email for the last seven years in 24 hours and deliver it to the Justice Department that's a pretty huge requirement especially how many of you can go through the tapes you have today and find something from yesterday it's usually a pretty hard thing to do so it is good practice to be ready and budget this is what drives at all right and how can how can we be smart about the budget so it's not necessarily the money you spend today on the infrastructure you need it's the money you need to spend tomorrow and you know that old saying there's a there's never enough time or money to do it right the first time but there's always enough time or money to do it four or five times well I can tell you that proper planning on this is really really important and I think probably the most important thing about budget is a trusted vendor you need to have someone that you can trust that can give you the right advice and that's looking out for you and if they're just telling you today that this is absolutely one of what it's going to cost and there's no other way of doing this I think you need to think different so what I want to do with that is really talk bring up Ryan Klein whose ass an architect and qlogic to talk to you about basically the one area that we hear all the time and that is fiber channel best practices if I'm going to deploy a network and basically ass and how do I do it and how do I lower the cost in it and Ryan's going to tell us about some great exciting stuff here thank you Alex my name is Ryan Klein with qlogic and before we get started with the presentation just wanted to get a show a hand of the folks that do go out and deployed extra raid how many of them are using infrastructure hbas or switches from qlogic that's a nice number of people out there so you definitely be able to learn a little bit from a presentation about the sandbox 5200 switch our management software and some of the HBA is an infrastructure software that we have but to get started for those of you that are not familiar qlogic is an i/o company so yes what's an i/o company essentially what we do is we are the plumbing in the sand infrastructure the daleks talked about we connect from your servers all the way through the network to your storage and we have a pretty broad product line that consists of specialized asics that fit right in the server itself fibre channel I skazhi through the network so you've talked a lot about sand and that's what I'm going to talk about moving forward so we build those those Network those sand fibre channel switches that do all the protocol routing as well as we provide protocol chips that fit in products like the xserve raid so from a perspective of looking from a server to a network to a storage we provide that IO path from one end to the other so we want to talk a little bit about qlogic the fibre channel switch market and the transitions that we've seen all the way from the high end data center and the types of switching infrastructure that you may have seen in the past and the transitions that we're seeing in that market talk about stackable switches that this is the sandbox 5200 that I hope that a lot of you are familiar with and are we going to come more familiar with as you move forward and start to deploy some more sane and really understand the scalability that you have when building small network starting as small as 850 Channel ports growing up the very large networks such as 64 and 128 ports and in deploying a very scalable cost-effective architecture and then we're going to talk a little bit about sand interoperability Alex touched on this as being a very important part of deploying a storage area network and it's really key to making sure that all the componentry that you have works together isn't supported and their solutions that you're not going to run any any issues with so we talked a little bit about all of these components that qlogic makes and so how does this come to you what are the strategies that allow you to make use of these products well what we're going to start to see is that we integrate our products into the sands that you go deploy so you'll see fibre channel hbas inside of the servers taking our fiber channel a6i skazhi asics putting them on the motherboard you know most people today have deployed servers have IP integrated on the motherboard you probably familiar with scuzzy on the motherboard same thing is happening here with fibre channel we also integrate switches into the componentry that we have so if you look at a lot of the bladed environments that are out there today they've taken the technology such as the sandbox 5200 which today is deployed in a box product and they've integrated it right into the back end of those products so you know moving forward the storage boxes like extra raid and various other storage boxes have the ability to integrate switching architectures into those boxes there's a lot of things like that will be coming out we're simplifying and lowering costs and what does that really mean to you so when Alex asked how many people here are storage administrators and have dedicated people deploying storage I only think I saw one person raised their hand for what does that really mean well essentially everybody here has a lot of different responsibilities and functions within their IT organization as and they're developing products you're not necessarily ass an expert you know you have storage out there unit you know the storage area network makes sense your deployment but you don't not you don't necessarily want to have to know every single parameter and all the detail implementations to configure these types of things so what we're doing is we're building intelligent software that allows us to configure automatically these environments as well as provide ease of use to you so that you don't have to worry about all those detailed implementations the final thing that we're really doing here is we're delivering turnkey sand infrastructures so what this means is it gives you the ability to from a single perspective by all the componentry that you need to deploy a storage area network so today you know we need you need servers we need the interconnects and we need your storage well what are all the pieces and parts that you need to go deploy a Sam if not very familiar with all the componentry could be somewhat overwhelming so the idea is to provide a turnkey solution that allows you to purchase the storage networking switch all of the optics and things like that that are required all of the cabling as well as the host bus adapters that go inside the servers and to be able to do that in a heterogeneous environment so these types of these types of kits are allow you to cross Windows Linux netware Solaris as well as OS 10 to deploy heterogeneous environments and manage them from a single location talk a little about expanded management and this is what I just mentioned is we have something called our San server management suite and this is a device management tool it's java-based and really complements the XOR of red gooey so Alex talked about lund mapping lund masking the ability to point specific lungs at specific servers this software really complements this and what you're looking at here is a picture of our brand new just released OS 10 GUI for the sandbox 5200 switch what this allows you to do is configure the specific sand ports switches and all the functionality in a heterogeneous environment crossing all the applications that we show at the top there works out really well and complements all of the Apple tools and integer java-based as I mentioned let's talk a little bit about the switch market and what you've probably seen in the past and where we believe switching to go so here's a basics and this is a 4 switch mesh you see a bunch of xserve servers at the top extra ray at the bottom from tape backup as well as some heterogeneous environments and if you wanted to go deploy this environment or something similar to this a few years ago those are some rough numbers or what you'd see it would cost the switching environment really stands out here your force force switches their cost roughly twenty thousand dollars apiece roughly eight going to about 80,000 to the total so that's a large part of the overall sand it was cost prohibitive for a lot of people to put together storage area networks so what do we see we saw most sands being deployed its large enterprise and from a show of hands earlier this morning most people here aren't deployed large enterprises they're more the small and medium business side so fans are really cost prohibitive as we move forward one of the strategies that we're working with apple on is to be able to bring storage area networks the functionality the xserve raid brings you down to the small and medium business and be able to develop the platforms it's a sub $15,000 level for the entire solution as well as still scaling all the way up to the enterprise so the sandbox 264 switch is a chassis based switch that allows you to be at the very high end here as well as the sandbox 5200 which we're going to talk about in a few minutes really allows us to scale all the way from eight ports through the small to medium business they are all up to 64 ports so we look at these various areas if we're looking left to right on this slide what we see is that in a pass sands were for large enterprises and if you wanted to deploy something in that enterprise you really only had one or two choices for deployment you either had a large director class which something like a McDade ax or a brocade box and then you had edge devices that were sport didn't have a lot of choice and were really limited in scalability in functionality and it was very expensive as well as we move forward we see things like extra raid being announced really starting to enable the small and medium businesses as well people that want to scale to the higher end and at the same time you're starting to see products from qlogic come out there chassis base switches as well as stackable switches and embedded switches stackable switches here are the most disruptive technology to the sand market that's ever happened so everybody here is probably familiar with IP environments where you had stackable IP switches you needed an extra switch you scaled you dropped it on the stack he plugged in the interconnect and you and you grew that didn't exist in the fibre channel market and it made a lot of sense so that's what we went out and brought to market and as soon as we did that we started working with Apple because we realized that they were had the same industry strategies they wanted to bring a scalable sand architecture to the market and our product strategies fit really well in moving forward what we're starting to see is sands for the small to medium business as we're driving costs down the model for something like a sandbox 5200 allows you to start out as small as eight ports and grow at the same time the embedded switches start to come into play here taking those steps switching technology and putting it directly into the storage arrays or directly into bladed environments for servers and things like that really reducing cost and complexity so using the last two slides and compared them to this one in the next one in the past we had the chassis based high availability directors large port counts as well as we have the eight and 16 port six switches so of the folks in the audience that raised their hand regarding having switch infrastructure how many people here deploy chassis based or director class switches I see one or two hands almost nobody so everybody else here by show has 8 16 port switches 6 port okay so they're your really locked into a strategy where if you want to scale that environment you have to take another switch and connect it in via inner switch link and start using up those valuable end-user ports to do that so where do we see this going stackable switch market sackville switch market allows you to scale an environment you can still continue to leverage the existing 8 and 16 port switches that you have but you connect them directly into the stackable switch and scale that way even if you need the high availability high port count switches you start using the chassis based switches and you see how they complement each other giving you a choice to scale from fixed port environment through stackable all the way up to the hype or count chassis switches to really be able to pick the right switch for the right application so here's a little bit of a few of the industry and the major players that are out there and some of the products they have the most of you are probably familiar with the cisco small little company mick data brocade as well as key logic and and you see that everybody out there really is offering fixed port switches not not giving you too much choice or scalability qlogic has come along and really been disruptive and is offering the sandbox 5200 as well as the blade switch in the bottom right but one thing that you'll notice about stackable switches is they offer all of the functionality that you would get from a fixed port switch as well as they're offering you functionality that you'd see it's a director class so things like non-disruptive code load everybody here uses patches all the time well as we move forward we provide updated software and functionality to switches infrastructure part you want to make sure that you're up on the latest and greatest code well you probably don't to bring down your environment to do that sandbox 5200 allows you to upgrade firmware dynamically without affecting your storage area network other big things here are management software this is really important because it allows you to manage the environment and doesn't cost additional money to you as well as all of the features such as monitoring and performance and things like that are included in these environments where you may not get those in a fixed support violence so we're going to introduce here the sandbox 5200 to you by a show of hands how many people here are familiar with the 5200 switch that's great that's that's a great number of people here so the 5200 it is a says 16 2gig ports and for 10 gig ports so the 16 too big for its really kind of be viewed as a fixed port architecture what the 410 gig ports and you got cut off here on the right-hand side I'll show us you in a later slide are used to interconnect those switches together it's a 1u box it's managed just like an eyepiece which would be managed it has an Ethernet port as well as an rs-232 port it has something that we have we call configuration wizards I mentioned this a little bit earlier configuration Wizards allow you to step by step configure and deploy a storage area network without having to know all of the details required to do so 5200 can be deployed in about five minutes from a configuration standpoint and you're ready to start plugging in X or raid boxes automatically discovered and configured and you don't have to worry about what's happening and why it does it all for you io stream guard the folks in here that do full stream video video as well as backups this is a really cool feature that I'll talk about in a minute but it's the type of feature and functionality that qlogic works with Apple on to ensure that we're serving all of the needs of the folks like yourself 1u chassis i mentioned integrated power supplies things like that as well as stacking up to four units so you this is a scalable architecture that allows you to license the ports and for port increments start with an eight port box and you license and four port increments all the way up to 64 ports this is the other thing that's a pretty a pretty interesting aspect to the stand switching market if you look at some of the competitive products as you grow and scale ass and your purport cost really goes up so if you look at a brocade box or McDaid abox you're paying a thousand dollars report to start out with that doesn't include any of the management and monitoring software but if you look at a qlogic environment with the 5200 you see that we scale across from 864 ports at the same price pretty important that way you can buy an infrastructure piece such as the switch and start out with a low port cast and grow all their 64 ports not worrying about having to pay incrementally more money for ports as you grow 10 gig is else this is really a disruptive technology to the industry we're the first switch to have 10 gig functionality and we use it on the right-hand side there you see those copper interconnect cables left-hand side here is a picture of a large 64 port mesh that you would have to create if you wanted six port environments so if you wanted to scale that large that's what the environment looks like requires 30 cables just to connect the infrastructure together and by the way those ports that you had to use you can't use for your devices your tape drive and your disk drive and your servers anymore in a 64 port stack using geologic on the right hand side you get to use all 64 ports you don't lose those those valuable user ports when deploying a 5200 solution not to mention the amount of cables and an infrastructure mess that you would have to manage with 30 cables and the redundancy problems that you might have the other thing to mention here is the 10 gig speed you be able to connect those switches together with a 10 gig bandwidth and in a fixed port environment even if you start out with two switches and you scale the third and the fourth you're only having a two gig bandwidth between those switches so that's one major aspect of 5200 that really brings a lot of advantage break the reasons of use so you know qlogic really looked at what Apple had done with ex serve raid in the gooeys and the tools and the ease of use that's available today you know that's one of the biggest things that you hear about Apple floppers how easy it is to use we took the lead there from them and we were able to integrate that type of technology into the software that we have for the sandbox 5200 as well as the stands for for management suite that we've built really being able to provide a stackable architecture with all the value-added software that's easy to use we really think that's important and it really looked at it the best practice in the industry because it provides you with ease of use for here's iostream guard I mentioned this before this is a really cool feature with qlogic switches it's exclusive to qlogic switches and for those of you that aren't familiar with the process when you bring a server up and down on a sand or reboot a server on a sand something called an RFC an or registered state change notification goes out and what that is is is that server telling every other server on the sand hey I'm here or I'm gone when that happens it's only a split second but if you have server a talking to disk a and server be reboots and comes back up in this RFC n goes around the sand fabric server a momentarily pauses if you're an OLTP environment running a database or something like that not really a big big deal if you're streaming video or you're streaming a backup and all of a sudden bettors of pause what do you think happens at the screen not a good thing if you're doing high-definition broadcast so this this feature that we have cold I oh sweet stream guard allows that switch port to not acknowledge this something called an RFC n that way you can have continuous streaming video or streaming back up without having that port go down this is exclusive to the 5200 and really play as well with ex sort of raid as well as the customers that use this type of technology so best practices in San interoperability San interoperability is very important and it's something you need to look at when you're deploying sand solutions historically interoperability it really meant you know connecting product day with with product B doesn't work and you do the same like a game you didn't really understand how it worked and what to do and most of that has gone away and a lot of it has to do with things like the sand interoperability guide that qlogic put together this is something that's available on our website and you can go to qlogic calm and download it really what it is is a guide that allows you to build a sand it covers close to 60 different partners in the industry from qlogic to Apple to to backup companies like Veritas all the ISVs and i hv is out there multiple storage vendors multiple software vendors and what it really is is a guide that allows you to know what works with what and how to put it together really key that you use a document like this when you're building a sand everything from the infrastructure components all the way up to the application layer to know what's out there and what works with what great document switch interoperability is also something very important to qlogic and something we work on continuously of the folks in the room there's a number of people that had deployed 5200 how many of you have deployed brocade switches that's great there's only a few of you I like that so the idea here though is that there are going to be a lot of people that have used other vendor switches and sometimes you're going to hear somebody say you have to stay in a homogeneous environment if you want to add another switch or grow two more ports you have to buy another brocade or another macdade to switch that's really not the case anymore you know there's a lot of advantages to using something like the sandbox 5200 as you continue to scale your environment but at the same time you don't want to fork lift out the switches that you have so this type of a document is the best practices switch interoperability document that gives you step-by-step procedures on how to configure new technologies we like to sandbox 5200 legacy technologies from companies like brocade the fixed port architectures and things like that so keep your existing technology continue to scale your environment and we give you step-by-step procedures on how to do that and something that really gives an advantage to you when you're growing those environments so the other thing we like to do is really educate our users are developers and provide documentation all the documents that I've been talking about fall under umbrella called qlogic press and it's really a educational arm of qlogic that is designed to provide really great white papers and documentation about comments and deployment so as Alex describe the various areas of Nass and daph and sand of course to logic is focused on sand and what we like to do is provide procedures and step-by-step and deployment scenarios for CN infrastructures and this is a series of guides that we built this one is an extra raid focused document and it really gives you an idea of common topologies how to configure how to deploy there was a lot of topology screens that the daleks showed you and those are in these types of guides plus it tells you how to configure it so you know that could be very complex very quickly your lines everywhere and devices connected in multipathing and heterogeneous environments I've got a network server i have a linux server how do i connect that in how do i do lon mapping how do i do lon masking we try to take all of that complexity out of it by putting together guides like this with step-by-step screenshots that give you the ability to go deploy effectively so in summary qlogic is an i/o technology leader we want to provide you with the infrastructure to move your data from your server to your storage via a fan network we make fibre channel switches as well as fiber channel hbas the cross heterogeneous environments you can deploy in numerous solution environments as well as manage them from a central location in addition we have new technologies like the sandbox 5200 that you're going to see it just continuously become easier to use more functionality and as well as price being reduced to enable more people to deploy stands and take advantage of all the aspects of shared storage the ability to pull your storage to more effectively backup your storage as well as to use sand to better your businesses we touched on interoperability and how important interoperability is to your environment making sure that when you build sand environments you take advantage of things like the sand interoperability guide that guy gives you all the visibility to what works with what and how to deploy as well as taking advantage of things like the extra raid configuration guide that we put together and finally you're going to see apple and qlogic working closer together to continue to bring you solutions documents and things like that and continue to build environments to take complexity out as well as allow you to scale sand environments and really take a competitive advantage or over you know your competitors as well as building solutions that allow you to scale from small environments all the way up to large 64 128 port count environments thank that was great Ryan I brought one of those the sand configuration guys just give you an idea how thick and complete this is and I can tell you that with this guide just about anybody is able to build a sand with the next with the next serveraid now obviously if you're doing something like deploying an xserve rate and xserve you're deploying you're deploying X and you know the physical part is really going to be hard I mean it really is how do I set that switch what do i do if I've got video do I need to turn something on turn something off and it's all in here and these are available online from qlogic so thank you ryan for doing that what i'm going to do now is I'm actually going to turn it over to to Steve a terrific from candara who's going to really talk to us about an interesting case study that we put together with candara and where the customer is actually a shiet day who's a large ad agency it just happens to be apple's ad agency just had nothing to do with that actually but they were really facing something that is something that everyone faces out there and it's really a mission-critical storage environment and an issue they had for a long time in heterogeneous city and candara apple and qlogic all got involved and we're able to really do something that's incredible so Steven you want to take stage here please thank you so one of the interesting things when you start to look at at what Apple geologic in Canada are talking about is addressing the needs of mission-critical storage but not as the prices that the big players in the big vendors are pushing on the fortune 200 fortune 500 company what they tend to miss is the fact that there's a large not number of companies that need mission-critical stores need the mission critical the availability the performance the performance scalability that you could find in a monolithic storage device but certainly not at the forty dollars per per gigabyte plus that you typically see when you look at a monolithic device so today I'm going to talk about shy pay and how they build their mission critical infrastructure on a combination of cute logic and era and Apple products then talk a little bit about this new architecture the ability to build this intelligent a TA and then close it up with the what that means how much can you apply this to your infrastructure whether you're an enterprise or a a small to medium business and of course that's not it so who is shia shia say is one of the largest advertising firms in the world in the u.s. they have very prestigious prestigious clients including Apple adidas others and the application the primary application for them is digital content so graphics and photos those types of things so for instance you might think that that's not a lot this presentation is about a 90 minute presentation probably 50 60 slides how many people in the show of hands thinks that this presentation is under 10 megabytes how many think it's under 20 megabytes now 50 over a hundred it's actually over a hundred now we we scaled it down to about 40 by rationalizing it but when we were developing it was over 100 megabytes now imagine 500 professionals working daily with multiple copies of presentations of this level of quality trying to do digital content and you can see how quickly it can grow and this is their business they're responding to very tight deadlines of clients that are paying a lot of money for advertising don't want to see things missed and they need to access all the time because creative people like that work very long hours very rigorous hours and so shy a day this facility and in LA needed seven terabytes of storage to handle 500 clients their new york office needed 21 terabytes so what did they have originally what was the before the before was a heterogeneous server environment made up of Novell Apple HP servers all would direct attached storage so every server had its own storage different departments had different projects on different servers and sure enough the server that had available storage that department didn't need the storage while it's the top of the department that really needed the storage had a server that had no storage on it so you ended up having a managed and environment that was very difficult to manage very poor utilization the other aspect to to shia this is not a Goldman Sachs suit that has a liberal ID Department it was a very limited IT staff and a limited budget so they needed to focus on how can I build this infrastructure that I can manage most cost-effectively the other thing is storage planning how do I plan for the growth how do I plan for the scaling as they brought more and more services and more clients on it's an unpredictable demand flow they land a big client they need more storage very quickly how do they respond to that environment and the other thing is with it with a gas environment backup is difficult and in an environment where you have high availability they need to be able to consistently backup and restore the data in this gas environment you have different backup regimes so what we did is we recommend it as sand we took a pair of 5200 qlogic 5200 and what we call it can Derek Apple APA appliance which is a number of apple xserve raise aggregated with canned areas network storage controller and what that allowed them to do is deploy a very easy sand storage there's the the qlogic Sam provides the connectivity the candara Apalachee a appliance provided this this stories that could be deployed in seconds and provisions very quickly the other aspect to this is the fibre channel level of reliability when when shia day went out to look and say what can i buy they looked at fibre channel storage modular and monolithic storage they believe that's what they needed when can Aaron Apple came in and said no you can do this using serial ata technology they looked at us and said you got to be kidding but we were able to provide the kind of active active high availability the kind of tracing and diagnostics that you typically find in a monolithic storage device with the kundera Apple solution also it allows you to centralize the data assets so I could have the physical storage here of the apple xserve raids and then with the virtualization and the centralized management provided by candara create virtual lungs that i could very flexibly provision to the various hosts and those hosts were heterogeneous host including HP Apple novell environment the other key aspect to that is the error detection and correction so when you look at a San environment is when there's a problem in the environment maybe a flaky HBA or or something that goes that goes awry on the storage it's very difficult to diagnose the more complex this and it gets the more difficult but with an aggregating element in there you can then do very quick error detection and diagnosis and the other aspect and the other benefits of this is by moving from a dad's environment to a San environment you d link to store the storage from the host consequently is very easy to replace host to add new host and to buy smaller servers so were they happy so this is a quote from shy a day where they said basically we didn't think we could do our storage infrastructure on a TA but candara and Apple were able to deliver that at a fraction of the cost of monolithic or modular storage they were so happy that after the evaluation with the LA system they bought the 21 terabytes New York system at the same time and they had planned a phased implementation they bought everything up front so what is this partnership with candara and Apple why are we together what are we doing the candara Apple ata appliance take the component takes the guts of what you'd find in a monolithic storage device by ways fine-grained virtualization and centralized management and uses that to aggregate Apple superior ata technology so when you look at a monolithic device what you typically find in and pull back the oldest sheet metal you find components that handle connectivity and virtualization and management components that provide raid processing and those types of things and they're able to scale because as you need performance and capacity you add more controllers as you need connectivity you add more disk adapters channel adapter so you can scale the performance as you need modular devices can't do that but the combination of candara plus Apple allow you to do that they allow you to scale both the performance and capacity together also enterprise-class the high availability the ability to do active active failover the fault tolerance those types of things are very important when you look at environments we talked about legacy storage and how messy can be in there what that what we allow you to do is start by building this APA appliance and then start to bring in your legacy storage and provide one centralized approach so interoperability becomes very easy and so when you look it's now a new approach to to to a storage architecture monolithic approach was the first approach big manageable scales but very expensive modular starts small but but but doesn't scale now you have this intelligent ATA approach that allows you to start small but aggregate all those devices into a big one big virtual disk in fact the combination of candara and Apple allow you to build an architecture that matches that monolithic architecture what does that mean what that means is you can manage everything from one centralized approaching and have a management GUI that will work and allow you to scale and work like a monolithic device so from a standpoint of tiered storage when you look at how do you apply ATA into your environment most of the the existing players say it's only good for secondary storage we believe the existing players are wrong they're just protecting their fiber channel business today candara an apple working together will allow you to address that tier 1 tier 2 environment the mission critical environments would with the solution that we put together similar to shy a day so the analysis i did when i looked at the market and talk to people about how much of their storage is over served by fibre channel and broke down via via applications we really believe candara that seventy percent of your data center can be stored on ATA storage if the data center if you if you're using fibre channel modular or fibre channel monolithic storage for more than thirty percent of your data center you're really burning money so where do you use intelligent ATA this is a this gives you an idea of the various applications that you could put it in and as well as the capacity requirements anywhere when you get over a terabyte sorts of capacity this kind of so will work very well so I have run out of time I'm a little bit over but I appreciate the chance to talk to you about Shia bay and how the combination of the three vendors that presented today built a mission critical infrastructure out of very cost-effective components fantastic thanks thanks Steve I appreciate it the you can see that today there's a lot of choices in storage and the candara the candara and Apple solution is an interesting one it's one where you can actually take high-performance storage combine it with the feature set that you get in very very expensive monolithic storage those three letter acronym name companies and you can really build a system that is very cost-effective and scales a lot better and so what I want to do really quickly is wrap up and we're probably not going to have time for for Q&A today so what we're going to end up doing is talking the afterward but just to wrap it up real quickly I think when you look at the summary of what we've talked about the first thing is to remember his budget budgets going to dictate your infrastructure and we think we have a building block storage product that allows you to do that the second thing is that complexity is always going to equal cost so the more complex it gets the more it's going to cost and of course scalability is something you need to address the front and you have to really look when you're talking about scaling it is what is your real world usage of the systems and you don't want to overlook the backup needs that you have because a lot of people say well I'm putting in raid storage I no longer need to backup and nothing could be farther from the truth than that you only when you put in raid storage what you need to do is be more concerned about backup because you get a false sense of security and then the last thing is considered to your storage because if you look at tiered storage and you look at these approaches and not spend that money on that monolithic storage for everything you need you can build an infrastructure that matches your needs going forward and I can guarantee you one thing and that's that we're going to continue to drive the ease of use from the price of storage down I appreciate everyone's time today thank you very much you