WWDC2004 Session 710

Transcript

Kind: captions
Language: en
hi everybody thank you very much for
coming this is a an experiment for us
this is a full QA session and we've seen
it work really really well at other
conferences before I sort of describe a
little bit about the the session itself
I'm going to describe what it isn't so
this is not the QuickTime feedback forum
the QuickTime feedback forum is on
Friday at 5:00 and that's where you know
you can ask all the questions and the
you know sort of we'd love the product
to do this this session is more intended
for okay we understand that the product
doesn't do this what's a good way around
that or as a content provider we're
trying to get this accomplished what are
the potholes along that path what are
the best strategies and we are so lucky
to have all of these folks both on the
panel and in the audience there's
clearly you know dozens and dozens of
experts you know I see many people that
we we know quite well as experts in the
field so my hope is that the way that
this works is you'll come up and
definitely want to use the microphone so
that it's recorded accurately and ask
the question and then we'll sort of take
a second to figure out who can probably
best answer the question there may be
times when it's somebody in the audience
and we've seen these sessions go
completely haywire within the audience
is answering the audience's questions
and the panelists just sort of disappear
about kidding but we'll start it off by
having I'll pass the mic down so that
each of these folks can introduce
themselves and their general area of
expertise so that then the questions can
be sort of formulated based on who's
here there are we don't have you know
sort of people from the Pro applications
product group so you know in-depth
questions on Final Cut Pro may be a
little bit difficult but within this
sort of spectrum and the people that we
do have in the audience hopefully we can
answer a lot of your questions and get a
good dialogue going on and if there
aren't a lot of questions then it'll end
quickly and that's that so my email
address should come up here and never
never mind so if you've got feedback on
how this might work better give it to me
and we'll sort of see if this session is
worth doing over and over again we've
got a lot of these folks typically in
the labs but to have them all available
at a fixed time here is something that
we're really happy to try out so with
that I'll hand it over to Ryan Lynch
Ryan Lynch I'm in quicktime product
marketing and I handle everything there
is to handle with us say QuickTime
streaming server to embedding in
webpages and fun things like live stage
so that's what I do I'm Eric blonde PA I
spent a long time working at Apple on
quick times interactive stuff and now
I'm on my own doing a variety of things
interactivity and mixing media I'm
really into taking lots of different
kinds of media and putting into the same
movie and it's also pretty fun to do
things that require a lot of resources
out of the server a lot of getting data
in and out and that's all fun stuff so
that's me
I'm John Healy with Akamai Technologies
Akamai is the content delivery partner
for Apple we deliver a lot of Apple
streaming content as well as a broad
variety of HTTP content as well work
closely with Ryan Glen and Dennis in
their organisations in terms of getting
apples content out on the web more
effectively hi I'm Alec Henry from MTV
Networks you can Ireland and my
speciality is a lot of interactivity
stuff and now with QuickTime mainly
focusing on two-and-a-half and 3G video
mobile contents I'm Steve Cooley I'm a
roadie for Apple and my specialty is
HTML stupid web tricks and using the
QuickTime Player as a code of Swiss Army
knife or QuickTime content I am Ben
Wagner and I'm a compression nerd hi I'm
mark Griffiths from flourish we design
and develop a lot of interactive
QuickTime particularly with live stage
media players that sort of thing I am
Michael Schaff do interactivity with
live stage a lot of front-end and
back-end stuff and loud bright shoes hi
I'm giving us you know and I'm the way I
am I am the voice between the developers
and the programmers of last days I have
to speak with those guys went to
translate in French then to the
developers
you know make to me the village all
right so let's have our first question
excellent
go ahead Adam will Omni on video
networks we're moving our file system
over to that we can be compatible with
Europe and Asia and everywhere else and
our question is about encoding media
paths and alias atoms and QuickTime
files is there a recommended practice
for encoding the inter code strings in
alias atoms utf-8 utf-16 double byte or
if this is confusing to you guys it is
to us any takers
who's the taker can you speak a little
bit more closely to the microphone so
that we can hear the question again oh
you can
yes we're we're writing our own
QuickTime files the alias atoms that
point to media files within the
QuickTime wrapper or normally encoded in
a file system dependent fashion we're
moving our entire file system over to
Unicode and I'm curious what the best
way is to put Unicode strings into alias
atom media paths utf-8 utf-16 double
byte something else it will be utf-8 but
it's not supported yet I don't believe
we have just introduced in Tiger UTF
support for user data atoms and we're
moving towards that throughout the
system but right now you really can't do
it what you need to do is contact Apple
engineering and get it on the seed list
for the next rivet of the file format
because we're ahead in the same
direction you are but we're not there
yet we have to release it in August as
part of our release four of our media
server software so if utf-8 is the way
to go that's the way we'll proceed
that's the way to go and one of the big
things is you'll be using a different
kind of instead of using the Mac
language coding you'll use the three
character ISO encoding but you'll only
use the least significant 5 bits because
you're going to pack them all into a 32
bit field or something ok and if we want
more information on this the best way is
to get on a tiger seed list or yeah
contact me and I'll get you in touch
with the right people
okay I'm sorry your name again Steve
goolie goolie at Apple calm thank you
thanks hello this question might be for
Ryan is there a workaround or trick to
launching multiple instances of
QuickTime broadcaster to on a single
machine I heard somebody mention in one
of the sessions that they were doing
that so that you can encode multiple
streams on a single machine QuickTime 6
broadcaster using the same DV source for
both instances so actually launching
multiple streams
I'm not live yet so launching multiple
streams or multiple instances of
broadcaster is not a supported activity
so it's not something that well I was
asking for the workaround exactly
exactly so who has experience doing that
nobody has experience doing that there
are some alternative apps that we
haven't tested fully but that are
capable of doing multiple streams Steven
you want to comment what's that at the
Wirecast right I've experimented with
that a little bit but the the gentleman
from University of Wisconsin presented
earlier this morning mentioned on their
excerpt cluster they were doing that
somehow I should probably ask him I
didn't have time to ask him I thought
somebody else here might know also you
want to do you want to know how to try
it yeah you figured that out so you just
move it and then reinstall is that how
you doing
yeah you just copy it and name it
something else but can they both access
the same levy source so they both can't
they both can't access the same DV
source but they can do many many audio
streams okay we didn't even that access
the same DV so yeah unfortunately for DV
that doesn't work but for analog or any
other mechanisms getting it is because
their deafness that's a beating thing
with QuickTime that we need to resolve
so they must be using it just to because
they have these tuner cards or different
source so there yeah if you put in
multiple of those Miglia tuner cards in
there it'll work I see yeah and then
does anyone have any recommendations for
products that for live webcasting that
tightly integrate with PowerPoint or
keynote that are out there today that
that could you know put slides up on
viewer screens next to the live stream
and when a user in the studio say clicks
on a different slide in keynote or
PowerPoint it sends that command down
the flip the slide so there's a
gentleman from the University of Sydney
that wrote an app that looked to be
tremendous for doing that uh-huh pardon
doesn't that involve export the stuff
out of PowerPoint it's not editing it in
PowerPoint I don't think well everything
I've seen you know that does anything
with PowerPoint integration tends to
require exporting the slide deck into
some other format and posting it on a
web server either into like PNG or JPEG
z-- or something or just images then it
sends URL flip commands but what I was
really yeah what I was really hoping for
though was something that would besides
just converting it and sending those
script commands if it could actually
monitor a person running the PowerPoint
or keynote deck and see what slide
they're on so that the person running
the encoder doesn't have to follow along
and know what slide you know URL flip to
send
Brees does that it monitors PowerPoint
but isn't it it's also flash spark video
only it too isn't it isn't it doesn't
only do flash spark video it doesn't do
QuickTime encoding right right at
something that would work for QuickTime
I know of some solutions for windows
media to do it but I'm looking for
something with QuickTime there's the
product that the 20% free media guys
have the tarantella baja streak Astrium
that's that's ruled out because it
requires a proprietary player to be
downloaded and installed on all viewers
machines a proprietary server and
licensing fees for simultaneous viewers
it's just it's too expensive and
impractical to deploy to thousands of
users in an enterprise their future is
also a little shaky because you don't
know one possible solution would be to
use something like channel storm where
you've got one video feed on the speaker
one video feed on the PowerPoint
presentation so the guy who's queueing
things up knows which graphic to bring
up and he's got his own graphics cube so
I think you could do it that way with
challenged one do you mean where you
take the PowerPoint as one of the video
sources right you you aim a camera at
the PowerPoint screen and you're the guy
who's in charge of sending out the the
images looks and sees what's there looks
through his queue of images and queues
up the one you want which sounds like
what you want to do there's no script
there's an actual human being involved
well we have other alternatives and if I
may answer that I have an alternative
for that we export the powerpoints in
JPEGs many JPEGs we asked for the person
that will hold the the representation
should give us the PowerPoint to export
in JPEGs and imports as JPEGs and then
we have a list of JPEGs and their suits
and then we play with that he gives us
at a kind of fridge but if you have a
very long presentation it can be tricky
and so it's a workaround with it
okay sure what's it called if you still
channels for all you can apply it
generously
okay great I'll maybe I'll check with
you after thank you and if you pop me an
e-mail I'll try and get to that Sydney
University of Sydney app when it shows
up and we can all look at it a little
bit more closely I heard about it two
hours ago so I can know much about it
yet
next question yes
I have been working in a workflow system
where I have a server centralized
encoder and I use cleaner for that and
we've helped of AppleScript I get my
workflow to work and I have 300 students
that post their videos and you know
cleaner is getting shaky and have many
problems of bugs and well I have to
question is what's happening you know
the bug about the time watch folder
there is a watch folder feature and
there is a time you probably clean them
at encoding time this is because in time
is shorter than the film itself many
times I can't think or finish maybe you
have that expensive the second question
is do you have an alternative I'm
looking for something not too expensive
but something that works with QuickTime
and Mac platform yeah cleaners has no
apparent engineering going on a more I
heard a couple engineers assign cleaner
as a product but is nothing much
evidence at a discreet in the actual
board progress for over a year now the
Matic product the two compression tools
right now that we're seeing progress on
on the Mac are of the compressor we also
have source and squeeze fours but
announced and I'm not sure the status of
Apple scripting is in there but I
believe is entered beta and up creating
contact that they probably and they're
very responsive about that kind of stuff
and give you some ideas on that this is
also a compression master from pop choir
choir out of Sweden and I don't know
that they do automation either but they
both support watch holders in
compression and all the kind of stuff so
they're kind of both working to fill
that cleaner niche and both are a lot
more stable today thank you
good answer and if when you ask a
question if you could give your name and
company that be also helpful I'm Norman
whole solid work for such a public
broadcaster you need the name it good
it's good you wouldn't understand anyway
right I don't just and with with using
Final Cut Pro to do do editing in a we
using ingest machines to do the
digitizing to Final Cut Pro injection
machines it's a little crazy we use
those big sophisticated application we
think with people who don't understand
what they're doing and they tend to
change things screw things up we need a
very simple QuickTime application just
to digitize photo JPEG 75% whatever
preferably then to transcode it to 35%
can't find anything out there that will
just do a simple job
everything will grab it but we can't
give any time code in nothing will give
us time codes as well and we need it in
time code of course anybody any ideas
does it put a stop invisible folder
product from back among the video vision
days get a pretty good standalone
QuickTime capture tool that work with
time correctly with the telecast hereby
reveal my age and I think there's a
little red in some fashion selling some
kind of troll not sure if they fill the
Mac os10 version though but if I checked
out pipeline digital
and we've looked at the pop wire people
of a confessional
but if did ingest master or something
but it's nothing to do fell to jpg or
yeah but the compression after they've
integrated our own codec supports they
don't actually support arbitrary
QuickTime codecs that said I thought
that motion JPEG they support internal
motion but not photo JPEG we used to
date cards technique cards always use
photo JPEG image brilliance it's much
better than overblowing for fuel Ducati
wanting motion JPEG instead it's 42 and
gives us four fields so for really like
95% of all applications could try to
capture video you're better off the
motion JPEG we did them and it was for
the small bit mates that we need
it was Rivage so we use photo JPEG it
will do what make you feel better
you can make I mean at worst motion JPEG
file I have about another 10 percent
higher data rate for the same quality of
photo JPEG we put in single field mode
so you could probably make motion JPEG
work for you so it's a little bit of
tweaking ok thanks hey I was going to
say doesn't squeeze ingest Eevee yeah
and then they do timecode squeeze can do
live capture off DV and yeah the new
version squeezed for my cable do
timecode I haven't haven't tried that
yet but they'll be an obvious feature is
your source always be be or do you have
other programs it differed it yeah it
definitely does not support digital it's
a DV only solution squeeze do you need
to capture it in higher resolution than
DV because you could use a converter
that there are some higher-end
converters about $2,000 from the likes
of Promax
that do a serial and rs-422 serial
between the converter and the digi beta
deck and they take the component or SDI
input converted all the TV output with
timecode and then
yes it's lower quality but transcoding
digitated to deviate morally
reprehensible though that's it on the
question okay I've got a question sorry
okay this is a real quick one this is an
easy one right I've got some
instructional content that I'd like to
have the end user let's say it's a drill
and practice thing and there's a
scorekeeper on you know on the screen
and they close out the QuickTime movie
and I'd like to have it so that when
they come back that score still there
and they can continue on it's an easy
one right this is an easy place to run
through this question run and money hold
the micro close to site and I don't want
to use any server-side stuff okay that's
too way too complicated
come on we got to keep this simple
another legislator well totally soaked
where they've loved the component to be
able to sell cookies to be able to save
some XML value to the user for this
table we made that available to table to
our developers and we are currently
description at all to be able to upload
that onto their server so soon you
hopefully will be able to do it I mean
you do have the variant 4.50 and so we
can do it from within you I mean we
provide you the ocean in two dollars so
you can angle subsea so pretty well you
can the Presidium acknowledge and
applaud is just the index just mod the
only thing that you cannot do is have
the I mean you can send your user to a
web page to download installer and
inside the component how about a related
question when are we going to see that
component on the QuickTime component
page ads on the description is going to
be in the future in the future
when in the future that's there's no me
that's not a question another question
that is said a crystal ball but absent
you know I know just a sweet hot rod Oh
on a related thing there is a share the
piece of shareware that allows you to do
live streams with slides synchronized
together called slides now so if you go
to slide now.com you can check it out
it's like 25 bucks
super simple excellent good answer and I
know you said you didn't want to use the
server but with XML file exchange you
really can send it or a JavaScript that
will submit a form so you know this this
is a problem that has been solved
you can apply the traditional value
can't right now there's no way to make a
QuickTime movie write something to the
users disk and and there are reasons for
that but you can send it send a
JavaScript submit or or mail to or or an
XML a list exchanged with the server
which is the way you can do it now you
know as long as the steps being put in a
webpage the cookie question can be
handle by the browser right
question on the right eye rich carton
Penn State University I've got somebody
who wants to undertake a project that
wants to put multiple live streams in
layers in a movie and the streams would
come to the front triggered by flash
buttons also embedded in a layer in the
movie and we're sort of trying to get an
idea of how many streams we can ask the
ask click time to handle within how many
layers can quicktime handle four streams
and I guess that's about it
mark do you want to take that not
particularly p.m. so whether you have an
old imitation of number of streaming
track that you can have inside a
QuickTime movie like turbo flash track
text track and so on you have no
limitation at all you have a mutation in
term of the bandwidth you know if you
try to send five stream at one
megabits/second to be too big so it will
depends on your data way then and
bandwidth on the client side
what you can do you can create or flash
in flash interface with set of streaming
track and you know stop one start the
next one stop one start and stop the
next one and switch them you will have a
little delay between the switch these
are live stream you can do that with
live stream live stream and that assume
assume assume gigabit bandwidth yeah it
has been done years ago with live stage
and it was with like quit and five I
believe
so it's possible yes just not too much
bandwidth yeah I like the idea of
gigabit bandwidth
where do you live yeah in a university
of course that's the right answer
next question I have basically two
questions one question is this flesh
supports streaming QuickTime streaming
format not at all
can one explain why that what's the is a
reason they are playing the same we play
like Microsoft they want to to build
their own streaming server so things
like that that that question probably is
good better at flash forward with it
it's also go to the next door I'm having
a hard time a compress impact for under
256 because in Denmark where I come from
impact 4 is a 256 is our ADSL lowest
denominator and the impact for is doing
a great job between 280 up to 512 and
800 but what's the problem now what
should I be aware are you going for
real-time streaming or progressive
download a progressive download a
real-time streaming also both suppose
okay
check out compression master compression
master is a good to pass in peg to CBR
mode which QuickTime itself lacks so you
can typically get substantially better
compression efficiency out of that
especially for low bitrate streaming
applications this clip x encoders a
single pass only and both squeeze and
compression master support to pass VTR
including progressive download and a
book can offer because it's to pass
substantially better quality the
QuickTime encoder itself can I mean
you've got to be the QuickTime in pick
for encoder it's it's a free way you get
to start with but you want to do we make
really high any code stuff duplicate
using squeeze or compression master the
Mac thank you
the other thing might be to also look at
the content itself and if there's a way
to crop to the area of interest and
maximize the compression on the area of
the image that's important you know
there's some savings there as well but
here is the environment ultimate size
involved
where I have no expect and nobody
expects working at the same time so I
have to respect their journalists they
do all kinds of understand I understand
and of course as h.264 comes onto the
market you'll see a substantial
improvement in either the amount of data
that you're saving for the same image or
increasing the size of the image that
you're compressing I Josh Glaser would
be art Institute's we have a large
number of campuses across the country
not only art Institute's but also other
college brands 67 two locations we're
building an infrastructure to do
streaming media across all the campuses
to you know which is typical I think of
a lot of companies trying to get
information from the top down and bottom
up I'm wondering if you know we found
some solutions on the windows side but
we're also a Big Mac shop as well so I'm
wondering if there's any solutions you
guys know of in in content management of
QuickTime content you know we're at at
the local level you know you're able to
quickly browse through content you know
I know that you know if you guys are
familiar with Beamer acres or some of
the other solutions out there that that
allow this type of functionality
basically you have a local streaming
server at at each location within the
organization and then it's basically a
web type interface but they're pre-built
you know type solution is extensible for
the content management piece so I'm
wondering if you guys know of any out
there
if you like be brick be brick will work
with a QuickTime encoded in pic for
files it will yeah already but network
deployed if you mix prettier in pacer
compile cut and drop it on there okay
and you're good to go okay dirty ID
bricks that's fine we don't yet we're in
the process of kind of researching and
building a project together we're also
looking at it from a digital signage
point of view - for our galleries and
different you know a student areas as
well to broadcast content so yeah you
know that would be more full screen type
stuff but yeah be Berger scale is great
from standard F down to like Yousaf and
don't have a high debt solution in place
but as long as your signage is only
going to be only going to be a standard
F it's quite consistent I mean get great
sound quality at like six to eight
megabits ok perfect - and I'll scale
down like you do tell a bit make 4k it
right there they have mpeg-1 mpeg-2
mpeg-4 solutions and if you go to their
website all the live streams that
they're doing right now are completely
ISO compliant playback fine and
QuickTime Player and the other ISO
players they're doing live events right
now from dr. Ballard expedition in the
Black Sea or something yeah I wasn't
aware of the support concerns yeah great
really you have some thank you
hello Dave Berggren from soma media I
have a question about QuickTime chapter
tracks we use them exclusively in our
applications we actually use try-works a
shell and if you use chapter tracks
inside a QuickTime you can actually have
a lot of chapter tracks and you can have
scrolling capability in QuickTime but if
you embed it into a web page I think and
definitely in tribe works you have the
you're limited you can't scroll so
whatever the resolution of your screen
is that's how many chapter tracks you
can you can display there a way to
actually have that feature inside of an
embedded environment like tribe works or
on the web Eric you've been voted in do
you want to come in that's probably
because I'm somewhat of both silly with
tribe works lately but I don't work on I
show
I can only think about workarounds ways
to get the chapter data out yourself and
then build lists there we've done that
but a lot of times it's more efficient
just to you the chapter track way quick
time quick tow absolutely today really
really easy and it's a great feature
that scrolling capability that's in
quick time but I'm wondering if tribe
works if there's a way to control it
within from like if tribes can do
something or if they're to actually if
the future is actually what have you
talked with tribe works engineering
about this yes but it's kind of on the
backburner and I don't even know if it's
possible so that's why I'm asking you if
it's impossible well we'll pass it down
there but I'd be happy to help talk to
you with them about it okay I don't know
about tribe works but with respect to
the QuickTime plug-in I would file it as
a bug with our bug reporter and see if
we can't get it fixed to the next round
okay
last answer on that I have built
something similar it doesn't have quite
the same question that you have but
basically processes over a chapter track
and then I have a small piece that is a
flash track that I can just drop into
any QuickTime movie and then what the
flash track is doing is auto-generating
movie clips so I can scroll that space
so for me it's better functionality than
what is done in QuickTime because I can
have it looked the way that I want I can
have the color scheme
yatta yatta yatta that I that I want to
have it's not a very difficult flash
task nor difficult QuickTime test it can
be done once and then apply to many
projects okay thank you very much
I'm having somewhat Carolina State
University almost like is jointed over
here earlier he is having a question of
broadcasting life events where the
speaker wants to do PowerPoint you
wanted a classic talking head the
PowerPoint is some stuff at the bottom
in the screen there's a company called
Envivio they're a member of the insa
consortium as example and they do have a
hardware Pike that is will do exactly
that it is about $15,000 but it's called
forecaster life and you literally take
your PC plug it into the back of this
device it has it takes VGA and encodes a
VGA stream and/or video stream and audit
you know in our screen also index the
content in real time and what generates
out is an h.264 stream now of course I
have had a chance to actually test this
with the pre-release of apples product
but I would imagine that it would work
quite well if it's Envivio basic
probably uses the bits binary format for
writings right which i believe is not
been announced for QuickTime ok it's not
supported today and that's that's one
things I want to clarify here is that is
that going to be something that you will
eventually be able to support it will
the video has a plugin for quicktime
player on windows today and they've
shown actually demoed at Macworld 2003
we had a alf of their mac version that
every ship that yet oh yes I've got it
running semester ok so yes if you have
that which can do bits that's a plug-in
but unless somehow looking at the Apple
to start include that as part of the
component download program well
obviously I'll be at the feedback forum
on Friday yeah ok I probably mentioned
this but yeah I'm already aware of the
issues and there is a course licensee
issue involved in this as well yeah
we're their product but it is say it
does exactly what they tell it say that
it will do is pretty amazing
hi I'm Amy I work at Apple I just wanted
to address your question about h.264 in
the tiger seed yes I know I know it's
not a complete I'm not know right you
guys have heard me saying that a million
times so far but I just wanted to let
you know that the way that it's in there
is not like all the other QuickTime
codecs at this point in time so yes I
know
elegant oh yes okay so to make sure that
was clear because it probably won't work
with us say for internal consumption you
should use it while you're showering
yeah I just mean that it won't if you
put another app on top of QuickTime I
won't show up no I know
nevermind I was trying to get to my
desktop machines so I could actually try
it out but never mind
but anyway it is a very cool product it
does seem to work great suggestion hello
my Coconino Community College in
Flagstaff Arizona I get a couple
questions for you the first one you may
or may not have an answer to and I was
wondering with the hardware requirements
or the projected hardware hardware
requirements of h.264 playback are going
to be I mean so clearly then hey it's
depending on on the data rate of the
stream that's to be decoded right so
we've shown on the dual g58 megabit 1980
1080 1920 1080 at 24 v and then in
steve's demo you saw a variety of data
rate so there's no set requirement
yesterday we showed it so so the short
answer is we don't have that data yet
because we're not done yet
so we'll have to get back to you with
the final answer with that but yesterday
in our session about it we showed on an
iBook and it was a 1 gigahertz before I
book that you could play back I think it
was 960 by 5 something because it was
sort of letterbox and that data rate was
5 mega so it wasn't 5 megabits it was
one and a half I think so anyway that's
just an idea of what we have now and
we're still working on it so
we don't have a final answer but we'll
get back and just another comment on
that there are about 60 companies that
have either pre announced or announced
that they're developing encoders
decoders all sorts of tools based on 264
and you know some of the decodes
hardware requirements are down to the
you know sort of subs 100 milliwatts
chips for you know mobile device decode
so the codec given its availability can
also scale on its processor on the
processor requirements for decode
minimum very broad range reach to 64 or
a cell phone or better alright my next
question is I want to capture h.263
content into a QuickTime file I want to
know if that's doable
yeah juice extreme codecs have been a
quick saying for years now since I
QuickTime for link yeah so just because
the codec you're doing look at em
broadcaster I get to go but I haven't
had any success and actually capturing
it to disk because that's what are you
trying to make a dot MOV file with 3
content are you creating pretty much and
yeah yeah it works
I mean before or sorts of 3 an mpeg-4
kit I mean in pay for came out that was
the dominant streaming codec in
QuickTime so I mean all the live
broadcast live including stuff was
almost all 263 you know until a few
years ago so it's been been there's been
working fine for a long time yeah you
mentioned that you tried it and it
didn't work so that I'd be a little
piece of information that would help us
what do you know coming out of Tandberg
6000 system just as a default stream
that's viewable in QuickTime can is the
McGinty
one of the interesting things is that
Tandberg themselves although they've
developed the QuickTime streaming
component actually didn't know how to
make it work and when they did their
testing all they ever did was did it
from a web page that was actually logged
on to the Tandberg 6000 itself and that
works fine I've actually just I mean
literally last week managed to get it
streaming from a codec so a QuickTime
streaming server and I'm actually going
to Oslo in a few weeks time to talk to
them about the 264 component because if
you've got an e series and sound like
6000 just be glad you've been able to
actually capture those strings here just
as flavor just display them we can we
can actually and I mean you what you can
do is you can you can capture it by
saved by just taking it out of the cache
and maybe Oh once it's strange or
machine you take out of the cache but
we've not managed to actually say that
as an ongoing stream but I'm actually
I'm going to also in a few uh end of
July to actually talk to their engineers
I mean I'll you are not talking
afterwards but you know the main reason
I'm going is because on the new e-series
6000 they've already got 264 embedded
and and you can go from six thousand to
six thousand of these to 64 so I'm going
to talk to them about saying well hey
why don't you stream the two six four as
well so thank you
thank you Gary Shainberg from BT Steve
Egbert Brigham Young University let's
say that I've got some movies on the web
progressive movies and I want to prevent
the smart guys from downloading and
ripping off my content so that means
that you wouldn't be able to pull it
into VLC and bypass all the wires bright
stuff do you think you guys can think of
a solution to prevent people from
ripping off my content lots of takers
here whose first you want to take a stab
at it first you look in the back of the
book QuickTime for the web there's a
couple cheapo tools while they're free
one of them will basically going to make
a reference movie copy protect it and
compress the header and then take the
header out of your source movies so that
it's a box of rocks
it's no longer a playable movie and
you've got a reference movie the points
to your web and some data on your web
that if they copy it to their disk
doesn't do anything because your movie
points to the web and if that was the
correct answer
what is Jacques in extending on the same
question if I want to project content on
an intranet would you do the same stuff
streaming live streaming or downloadable
content well live streaming is
inherently copy protected it unless
somebody's really really smart because
we don't keep a copy of it on the data
okay not could be protected preventing
access and authorized access I think
well let's remedy that this way you can
create an interactive QuickTime movie
with wild sprite and create some kind of
password that we send out to that others
and check we want to something else
as as good an idea as that would be that
actually won't be secured because right
now QuickTime only supports HTTP GET in
which case everything is visible on the
on the stack which means that the
password would be actually visible and
that would be a bad thing yes this is
another Club for the the totally hip
component that actually allows you to
encrypt what would go on the line and so
you could still see it but you wouldn't
be able to tell what the data is the
other possibility is to still using
wired sprites but get clever and build
your own encryption scheme and and then
upload that in which case you need a
flipside on the server side to actually
decrypt it then there's probably a lot
more details there but but ultimately
you have to look at what your audience
is expecting because it really does get
down to an end user question what kind
of environment are you delivering
content to and what kind of user
experience are they willing to go
through
well there is a nifty little feature of
QuickTime streaming server that gives
you QT access files so you can require
our name and password although there is
the same problem it is a get and it is
clear text over over your network that's
another possibility also I'm sure
there's this neat little thing with
Akamai you can do and they have a if you
have an account with them they will
allow you to tokenize your a your
references to the movies so that you
have to have a valid it validated
username and password that isn't done
through clear text you can do and
generate a link dynamically so that
might be something you'd want to talk to
this guy with about that one there the
last so shouldn't we be weather if your
major put the movie inside an HTML you
can have an SSL page before that will
request for the password and then you
have the whole you know the whole schema
to be able to protect your content
because they will not see the kuta movie
on that page before you can do the
security check
when we did the our is our annual
results which which has to go to a close
audience in the u.s. we did exactly that
you know we just created an HTML
environment linked it to a database made
people register with their username and
password and then took them to an SSL
page and SSL protected HTML page and
ultimately yes if someone once they
logged in once they could obviously find
the path to the movie but you wouldn't
get that unless you'd logged in in the
first place so Glenn put some money in
the meter please go ahead hi there brand
Frederick from the certified general
account Association up in British
Columbia Canada
part of this has been hit already but
just to kind of round up the solution we
are going to be in a situation where
we've got lecturers and speakers that
are presenting and we kind of want and
the most efficient read cheap but still
workable solution of being able to
switch between a video feed of the
speaker and also their slide
presentation so I guess kind of like
what was being done last year with the
WWDC material that DVDs well if you
aren't really cheap and easy you get a
scan converter you get a camera put
through a video switch but that's a lot
of good so if you really realize even
easy that's trivial to do and actually
give you pretty good quality you can
live with having the video signal the
analog kind of scan converter in reason
would that be good enough
what about digital options well well
well you either want to keep it easy to
consider actually a cheap cheap in these
years
the s-video out of the PowerBook yeah
the red you know that easier than using
a scan convert we we do that all the
time where we have a PowerPoint
presentation we just want to take it
full screen as a video source in the
live webcast and we used to use a scan
converter but we found that the s-video
out of the PowerBook produces cleaner
looking results than our scan converter
and doesn't have the same problems with
putting artificial black margins around
the image that scan converters often do
so I mean that that works pretty well if
you use any standard video switcher I
have to switch between live cameras and
and that fee it's obvious video outputs
being better than a lot of the lorentz
can governor's I sort of imagined like a
VGA to SPI thing that's probably more
than you want to pay it surprisingly so
I mean even slides like this with text
is small like that blue type translate
quite well down to life size of the 240
by 180 which would be appropriate for
like a 35 to 40 kilobit per second
stream for dialogue that actually works
no that sounds perfect back at the
obviously she was like a keynote version
like to which do all that stuff project
it's picky about because I have
absolutely no idea if it was get a lot
about example but yeah I got a chatty V
and kido feel like as a to do crazy kids
it gotta get together and some kind of
journey chachi kind of rainy but
definitely second that I have a question
has anyone does anyone know of any quick
on live encoding solution that works at
sizes larger than 320 by 240 that
produces good quality results at sizes
well I realized that you can set
broadcaster to a size larger but it's
actually scaling up from a half
resolution source there are number
products to do a light and take forestry
and I'll be quick Thai compatible with
higher frame sizes and that are they
software or they like a climb yeah picus
and Envivio both have them is also the
freeware
in pic for IP product has a live encoder
built into it which I believe can go up
to six variable rate and they're live
and today I was eighty interlace as well
on the pre-processing side pretty sure
the Nvidia product does
and I blew the deccan suppose it does as
well I'm not sure but anything for IP ok
because for whatever is you can't
compile out on a Mac tonight
I was like I'm not smart I do that it's
a there if it's all open source there
it's like a tune the way through never
fool busily linkers it like that but
yeah book looking Buda Texas products
can handle us and I believe also some
hardware and pay for work stuff out
there to explain to the job as well
all right interesting idea in a
Southwest and it'll be like doing it on
a there'll be a billion two six four
switches fourth yeah I want to run it on
power book for remote live webcast I've
also had some experience rich garden
from Penn State I did a one second
there's a little bit more to that answer
in QuickTime broadcaster that free
little app does go up to 640 480 as well
it goes up to 720 well 720 whatever you
wanted yeah that's what that's what I
would be be I have done a internet to
event streaming it out best I could do
with the top-of-the-line g5 was about 7
megabits per second but that was a full
screen high quality audio I still got
some blockiness
it just wouldn't encode all the way up
nope to kind of respond to what you were
saying QuickTime broadcaster lets you
set an output of 640 by 480 if you want
but if you look at the results it looks
like a 320 by 240 that's been doubled in
size and there are no interlacing
artifacts present in it okay and I know
it's not deinterlacing in real-time what
it's actually doing is asking quick you
know it's a source level in the
background it's throwing out the fields
it's almost certainly using the the fast
no DV codec which saves a quarter screen
a single field right so I'll starting
with a quarter resolution original that
you know size larger than 320 240 it
doesn't really look any better I had a
perfect solution for that will be the
QuickTime has got the hook down inside
her the high quality and single field
flags on decode which you can do a quick
time player we can't go to the encoder
if we just had access to those exact
boxes and so I've noticed is that live
channel and
our cast both seemed bound by that same
limitation they both seemed to produce
the same results as QuickTime six
broadcaster would when you set them
larger than 300 to 40 you probably is
probably you have to find a Prada be
decoded for real-time or simply says the
ability to override with the default
study for real-time is and because I'm
on our computer that the DV codec and
even even if our book could be is like
you know six as a real-time
Cheryl energy for know how insanely X
real-time energy five so the power there
to do because I'm suppose when we see
everything that Final Cut Pro can do in
real time on you know you can a nice
chief or you got to think that it should
be able to do it what would happen is to
compress any two times the bitrate now
I've tried that and you get less and
less compression artifacts and the
result that there's no higher resolution
to be seen yeah the decoder itself
solely handed off a quarter screen
resolution bitmap to the encoder or
digital processing engine so totally
like if you took a 320 by 240 in
Photoshop and doubled in size and
compressed it with high quality JPEG it
in fewer artifacts but it's not any
sharper duly noted I think you know
obviously there are the hardware
solutions that are emerging on the
market from a lot of different companies
and you know the V bricks and the dye
kisses and all those sort of companies
but you know that it may be a good one
that if we'll take it to the feedback
forum as well if you don't because the
points well-taken
thank you give two questions I have some
really bad examples with analog
switching using scientific PowerPoint
switching that I have in my lap at
really how not to do it is every gauges
of samples they're also on our website
don't look at them they're impossible to
view and that's one of the challenges I
had I'm Brian schooler check to Health
Canada national microbiology lab where
that of the CDC of Canada
this is something that I did quite a bit
of and discovered everything not to do
so this has been really helpful
I guess my so my point is that I found
some challenges the analog to switcher
and I've been looking at wire cats and
live channel ready to talk to the
software without using it I've actually
complained around last couple days of
wire cast I don't know if anybody's
experienced it seems to have a lot more
support for fruits around for lower
thirds for being able to bring up text
you can some respects replace the
PowerPoint that simple text or items I
don't know I guess that's my first point
who's played with it what does it look
like on the user's end and secondly is
there a resource make it point me to for
a rule of thumb for compressions a bit
of witch doctor II I have ten users
across Canada and my director says ok
how what's the pipe how many people can
view the stream can you point me to a
good resource which would just put
suspected bandwidth how many users could
be able to view the stream as I would
tell locking up if anyone has any
yeah I've been playing the White Castle
it does look quite good actually because
you can switch between multiple sources
that's quite nice sort of 3d DB effects
as well where it moves presenter down
into a little screen in the court a bit
much like the keynote speeches here you
can do bringing your slides in playing
around trying to export out of keynote
as a QuickTime and then bring you that
in and you can kind of step through the
slides from your keynote as a QuickTime
in one window while you or your video
source appears in the other and it does
seem to be working quite well yet I seem
to have the same limitations on the the
video size of the the sources are coming
from but it is quite nice that you can
just plug in a whole load of iSight
cameras and switch between them quite
easily so let's cool on the Bitterroot
frame you know it's a really calculator
calculator got out pretty all you need
to really do the details of it is to do
and how many megabits and paint be
available you know and with a bit rate
of extreme is going to be multiplied
together earning a theoretical value and
then you know chop maybe 25% off that
you know for overhead and just general
you know to click it to God so yes
that's pretty straightforward badly one
problem that was you from QuickTime
QuickTime laser mics measure things in
kilobytes per second and it takes a
kilobyte 1,024 bytes while prematurely
else the world measures things in
kilobits where K equals 1000 instead of
a thousand 24 so you can sometimes have
to like kind of shuffle some numbers on
in the background mo there are a lot of
tools that they're like compression
master and squeeze which make QuickTime
files but present it in terms of actual
to kilobit values that can make it a
little bit easier when you're offering
stuff or for you know streaming views
the impact for component will show a
teal also in kilobits as well but a
fortune if you open the file up in
cyclic time player it will give it to
you in K and a lot of people got capice
thinking that K values actually in K by
ok bits this way K bytes good point
I think it looks like the last question